#awinewith Sarah Goffin
MEET Sarah Goffin, Founder of Proof of Concept Creatives
You can find them here:
Transcript
Danielle Lewis (00:05):
Sarah, welcome to Spark tv.
Sarah Goffin (00:07):
Thank you. Thank you. Lovely to be here.
Danielle Lewis (00:10):
I'm so excited to chat with you today. We've already not hit record. I had a great conversation, so I was like, oh my God, we've got to stop because this is going to be, we need to savor this. Yes, exactly. Exactly. No, I love it. Let's start out by telling everybody who you are and what you do.
Sarah Goffin (00:29):
Awesome. So I'm Sarah Goin, as my name says, but I'm the founder and creative director for proof of concept creatives. So really what we are aiming to do is create scientific materials and that's for a wide variety of purposes. So that can be whether you're trying to communicate your research to get extra funding to further what you are doing on the bench, or that could be for some people if you've got a really cool idea, but perhaps your science background or you've got a slightly different background and you just want that extra level of scientific support in there. So really is a catering for everybody. So always very happy to chat about my business.
Danielle Lewis (01:05):
That is so cool. So this is obscure. I guess I've heard of many of these jobs. I love it. So how did you actually get into this?
Sarah Goffin (01:18):
Okay, so it's a little bit of a long background, but I'll try and keep it brief. I know I have a tendency to waffle it and I get too excited, but for me, my background is I'm a pharmacist and then I went to do a doctorate in medicinal chemistry and then from there I ended up working in the corporate space. So I worked in both medical affairs and compliance within the pharmaceutical industry. So something I found that was great but I also really missed was that creatives are a huge thing. There's these big companies that need to be able to communicate their science out. And actually since moving to Australia for the years, you'll notice I'm not a native to the country but have been here for three years from the uk. What we really started to look at was the biotech ecosystem, and that's something that's really, really vibrant here in Australia and something that I think was a real surprise to me moving here.
(02:12):
And there's these fantastic ideas and these fantastic researchers that are slowly transitioning up to make those smaller biotechs and to move on from there. And I think the niche that I really saw was you have the really big agencies that work with pharmaceutical companies and they charge huge amounts of funds to make great materials, but it's resources and money that these companies just don't have. Where I want to come in is to really provide that kind of ground grassroots support at a much more affordable price to really help them kind of get on their way. And also to provide that scientific consultancy where that commercialization comes in. Talking about your research really well, it's great to hear what you're passionate about doing, but how's that really going to years, years down the line, if we get to the point where it can be marketed, what's going to make that difference to the community? How's that going to benefit the wider society health outcomes that governments are looking into? And it's kind of again, filling that wider gap.
Danielle Lewis (03:16):
And it's really interesting, I guess as you've been talking, I've been thinking, yeah, we think about every amazing scientific discovery that we all get the benefit of whether it is immunizations, whether it's cures for things, whether it's advancements in technology, whatever it is that did have to start by someone just somewhere chipping away going, this might be a possibility, here's a hypothesis. And other people looking at them, they might be a little crazy or a lot of times they might be a little crazy.
Sarah Goffin (03:56):
I absolutely agree with that. And I think the other thing that I found through my study and through my work as well is you can be fantastic at certain areas, but I think the uniqueness that we are really able to bring is kind of that all round picture. So during my PhD, I worked with amazing scientists, incredibly clever people, but not necessarily able to communicate exactly what they were doing, which is a very, very key skill not only to network and to get collaborators, but then to kind of go any further from that. You can do all this great stuff, but again, it goes back to talking about you can have the best product in the world, but if people don't know about it or people don't understand it, no one's going to do anything with it.
Danielle Lewis (04:37):
Totally. I was literally just thinking how applicable it is for business. So lots of people start their business because they're really good at something and they're like, I just want to do, I'm a graphic designer, I want to do graphic design. But then they're like, don't tell anybody about the thing. And it is that you can be the best in the world or something, but if you don't show up and communicate it and tell the world about it, you won't find your people. You won't find your funding, your sales, your networks, your yeah. Isn't it interesting that it all comes back to that communication element?
Sarah Goffin (05:10):
Oh, it really does. And I think it is obviously applicable skills for life and education, I guess kind of as a slight tangent has also been something I've really been passionate about over the years. So something I've always done when I've done a lot of presentations at conferences and one-to-ones et cetera, is I have a theory that you can explain any concept to an 8-year-old. And the reason I say that is I think by the time you're eight, you've formulated concepts in your head. So even if you don't necessarily understand all of the big scientific words, you should be able to understand theories behind them. So I always used to test out theories with my niece who at the time was around about the eight years old and yet very bright kid and now off in the US doing ophthalmology. But at that time she was able to say, yes, I get it, or no I don't.
(05:55):
And it's things like talking about you can talk about brain neuroplasticity by talking about smart motorways and if you have a delay on a smart motorway or a diversion, that's actually what your brain does. If it has any kind of damage, you can actually divert that. So I think being able to think about communicating in that kind of way. And I guess for me something else that really feeds into that ethos and why I'm really passionate about this is I've really found that people get very put off and unfortunately I do sexist, but it is very true. It does tend to be women that I've come across that get really put off by STEM in general. So the sciences and the mathematics. And I've had people come to me and I've done tutoring say, I don't get this. I don't understand maths, I don't understand maths at all.
(06:38):
It freaks me out and it's okay, where are we getting stuck? And it's something sometimes as fundamental as understanding how a decimal point moves that they didn't pick up at school. It's freaked them out, they just are so scared of anything to do with it or speed kilometers an hour, well that's a kilometer in an hour, which is 60 minutes and the light bulb goes off. And I really think there's so many instances where people get so terrified and so this is something I can't understand or do that they actually miss the point of this is the little key that unlocks that knowledge to pass it on to others.
Danielle Lewis (07:20):
It's so interesting and even how we've come from how important communication is to how we talk to ourselves. I just noticed that I can't do it. I don't understand math, I'm not good at that. Just that barrier that we put up for ourselves. So wildly interesting how important communication is. Language is externally, but also internally as well.
Sarah Goffin (07:45):
Oh, and we are our worst critics as well. I know I'm terrible for it and I'm always the first person to be like, that could have gone better. And it's focus on the nine things that went great, not the one thing that went okay. And that's always something. And I think particularly having a very kind of academic upbringing, that's always been something that's instilled, which is great for getting good results, but bad in the sense of, or perhaps something where I kind of maybe spend too much time obsessing about something as opposed to thinking, you know what, that actually went, okay, there's room for scope of an improvement and we can improve that next time.
Danielle Lewis (08:22):
Totally. And it is, I don't think it goes away. I think you have to be really intentional about picking yourself up when you picking yourself, when you are saying those things that are negative and having go-tos. I've even found that. So I'm over 12 years in business, I'm turning 40 next year and I'm still,
Sarah Goffin (08:45):
Honestly, when you first said that on the first chat, I'm like, there is no way in the nice possible, there's no way you're old enough to be 12 years in business. You look significantly younger than I do. Woohoo, you just made
Danielle Lewis (08:58):
My day. But it's hilarious. I often say that to myself. I'm like, what the heck? You should have this by now. And literally this week on my to-do list, I've had to write down positive statements so that if I catch myself going into little negative land, I know the words I need to know, come on, this is what we believe, Danielle, this is
(09:24):
The real truth. Yes. It's wild. Our brains just fascinate me because they have a life of their own sometimes. So we've got to be really careful of the language you use and how we communicate, but it's so interesting. So anyway, we'll get off that topic. So I'm really interested then how you found, because before we hit record, one thing you kind of touched on was you need to be that interpreter for both the academic, the scientific community, the consumer. So bridging that gap between communications, but also now you're a business owner, so you need to also talk to all of these people like a marketer. How have you found almost being that person in the middle that needs to have all of those ways to communicate with people?
Sarah Goffin (10:13):
Oh, absolutely. So for me, I feel like the truth is it's been all the emotions. I think it's been a really exciting journey. I am absolutely loving working on my business, that early stage of getting set up, meeting people, networking, developing the background as well as those initial first services, which I think are great. At the same time, it's been pretty intimidating. So particularly, again, one thing I say, because one of my clients I was talking to and we were talking about startups and well, you've got a background in corporate with marketing, not necessarily just a natural thing. And I said the difference with working in a big corporate company is you have a team. So yes, you have oversight, but you don't get that nitty gritty. And it's very, very different when you're going from big corporate to small business. And I feel it's been really exciting, but it's also been a real challenge and very much outside of my comfort zone to really push myself more into that and that small business marketing space.
(11:14):
So I'm still very much learning and I think I'm just learning every day from new people. Everyone has a different perspective, everyone has different advice that I'm finding really, really useful. And even the number of people where I'm going to them and just looking to get their advice, and even from different industries as well, and everyone's got such great stuff to say. And I think the other thing I've found that I've been really grateful for is everyone's been really supportive. Everyone that's people come forward to give you advice or to potentially lay up contacts or to say, you've got this, here's the kind of stuff that you can consider or to work on. Maybe this will help just drum up a little bit more noise around what you're doing. So it's been everything, but it's been really good.
Danielle Lewis (12:02):
I love it. And you really do, I think in business have to have that mindset and perspective that it is lifelong long learning. There's so many different things in business that we have to figure out from day one, we step into the seat into the role. I'm like, oh cool, now I wear every hat as well as the thing that I'm trying to sell. So amazing that you've got that perspective. What do you think has been the biggest challenge moving from corporate to your own business?
Sarah Goffin (12:35):
I think the biggest challenge for me is, I think there's a number of things, but I guess the biggest one is really been, it's a very, very different environment and ecosystem. So again, it's having to be the person that does those networking, be the person that's that real point of contact. I am the company, which is fantastic, but that's the awareness and that's the spotlight on me. So I guess utilizing social media in a more business sense as opposed to more personal use of what are my relatives up to or friends doing in different countries. And I think, again, that's been a real learning experience for me of really pushing and putting myself out there. Which it's a very weird thing in terms of, I guess as a sidebar, I am very comfortable performing on stage or doing a presentation that is my happy space, which is very, very weird. I'm conscious most people hate public speaking or performing. My less comfortable space is going out and pushing myself out there in a more peer setting. And I dunno what it, it's, I think I just have a very interesting brain when it comes to that kind of stuff. But that's I guess been the real challenge for me to push myself into this, I guess new way of working for me.
Danielle Lewis (13:57):
Yeah, it is interesting as well that you would almost think that it's very similar doing a
(14:04):
Big presentation. And I often hear the reverse, to your point, most people hate the big public speaking, hate getting on stage, hate presenting, but then they're like, but if you just put me in front of one person, I'm going to happy. And it's actually funny, I relate to that quite a lot. I hate walking into a room of a networking event where I've got to talk to one person, remember names do its things versus if I just get up on stage, I can kind of forget about everyone else. I'm just here to say this thing, it's all good. So I find it way more confronting to do the one-on-one style events and networking opportunities, but you'd think it's quite similar. But I think we all have these little things that we struggle with. And then it's crazy because then we go, okay, now I'm a business owner. Too bad. Do you have to get too bad? You have to get over it and launch yourself into all of these uncomfortable situations.
Sarah Goffin (15:03):
And I think maybe part of it, as I'm reflecting on it, I think part of it for me is it's the control of the environment. When you're on stage, you can have technical glitches and stuff that happens, but you're under a lot more control. Like, I'm doing this performance, I'm doing this presentation, I may slip up, but I'm in control of this entire situation. When you're in that more peer setting, you don't necessarily know the kind of people that you're going to come into contact with. And the majority of people are lovely, but I think it's that it's almost a little bit intimidating of, it's the unknown of getting to know this other person and what are they going to be like, what's going to be their areas of interest? And then moving on to meet other people as well. So I think it's, for me, perhaps I'm a bit of a control freak and perhaps that's where it sort of manifests.
Danielle Lewis (15:50):
Yep. Very triggering. I think I as well. Oh my God, it's hilarious. And I think that, I mean, it's funny because I feel like character traits like that,
Sarah Goffin (16:02):
Yes,
Danielle Lewis (16:03):
They can be quite useful in some situations, but that ability to be self-aware and to realize where we might be holding ourselves back is another amazing skill you have to learn as a business owner.
Sarah Goffin (16:21):
I completely agree. And again, it's not necessarily the easiest thing to do either is to, I guess go back and reflect on what's going well, what can I do better, but actually making sure I take the time to genuinely reflect. I think again, I'm very, whilst I do do that, I'm very much a project and task face person and I can go, go, go. Again, that's the way you work in research, but I think taking that time out is just so useful.
Danielle Lewis (16:49):
Yeah, absolutely. And I think that it's funny, it's this time of year as well that gets me in that reflection mode, but it is so important, isn't it? We have so many items on our to-do list, so many big milestones that we want to achieve in business. And there is this propensity to just run just next thing, next hustle, hustle, hustle. And it's funny, the spark community always is very good at keeping me in check on our virtual networking calls. They're like,
(17:19):
Congratulations, you've got to take a stop now and have a glass of bubbles or take the day off, do something to celebrate that you've hit a milestone. Don't just move straight onto the next shiny object. Although it's so easy. I feel like especially at the start of your business, there's just so much to do. There's so many ideas, there's so many things you want to achieve, so many things you've got to get your head around that you never realized that you're going to have to get your head around. It is really hard to stop and reflect. Have you found that you've incorporated any practices to look after yourself and your mental health and your, Hey, I'm a human outside of business or any of that? Has that come into play for you?
Sarah Goffin (18:04):
So that's a very good question actually. So I'm very lucky. My husband is very supportive and I have a lovely little dog currently too because we are dog sitting and it's quite fun because they're not best of friends, but they begrudgingly deal with each other. Cute. I love it. But I think for me, the real thing that works well for us is he's very, very good at keeping me in check in terms of the world's not going to end, things are going to be fine, but we also we're both very silly. So the stuff we do every day is we play ysy every morning to see who makes the morning drinks. We also play ysy or another game slightly later in the day, and then the other person might get a back rub or just silly little things that cost nothing but just adds a little bit of fun to the day.
(18:54):
Because I think the thing that we found, and I notice it if I ever had to travel quite a bit for work is again, you get stuck in that go go mentality and you kind of just lose connection with your partner and then that becomes a really uncomfortable environment. So we are very big on really making sure that the time we spend together is quality. And I think that's what really keeps my wellbeing. And I think even if I'm ever not feeling great about stuff, a Ben's very perceptive. So he will tell me or he will ask, is everything okay? But also he's very good at, and because very empathic is things kind of aren't so great today, nothing's really happened. They're just kind of a little bit out and he'll be like, okay, do you want to talk about it or just want to hug?
(19:40):
And I'm like, hug will do. And so it's really having, for me, it's having your cheerleader and having somebody that's right next to you to just be that point of support. And he's also very brutally honest as well, which I appreciate because I think, again, I come from a world where there's lots of yes people, and I think going into an environment where it's like, if I get this wrong, people aren't going to want to work with me. I want to make sure I'm getting this right. And he's very, very good at being like, have you considered doing it this way? Maybe that could be a little bit better. But then also, hey, this is really good. So it's the whole picture.
Danielle Lewis (20:17):
I love it so much. I follow a lot of women in business, people on the internet, mostly Instagram. And it's really funny, there's this trend going around right now, it's like a viral real trend that's basically bagging men. It's this male dominated fields and I've just got super mixed feelings about it. Actually, my feelings are not mixed at all. I fucking hate it. I just feel like, so I have a very supportive husband as well, and we live in the middle of nowhere. So I do rely on him quite heavily for my mental health and connection and all that as well. And he has supported me through obviously this business, previous business, previous breakdown of founder and partner relationships, like stuff that a new boyfriend husband should never have to do. And I just think we'd spend publicly so much time bagging out men, but we really, there's a lot of us who are quite fortunate to have the support of a partner or a husband or a male colleague or a male friend. And I think we do really need to thank them and invest time in
Sarah Goffin (21:40):
Them. Oh, absolutely. And I think something else that, because I see a lot of those, I am a very proud feminist. I'm all about equality and having equal opportunities. For me, it's all about equal opportunities for people to feel that they can go for anything. I think the other part of that is also just the way that men and women tend to think differently. And so I think sometimes that piece around people going like, oh, men have done, it's actually, well, they're just thinking about your problem in a very different kind of way, or they're not getting it, but you are just getting angry as opposed to taking the time back and seeing what is the way that's going to communicate to them that they really get it. And you know what I've also found in instances where I'm very fortunate, I think I've only ever had a couple of times over the years where I have genuinely kind of rolled my eyes.
(22:31):
I think one of them was a snide comment because I've got a PhD, so I'm doctor and a guy checked my ID and gave me a squint and was like, you are Dr. And I. Yes. And then another instance when Tres driving a car and I love my stinger and my baby. And the guy was like, oh, well be careful. These cars do go very, very fast and there's a speed limit zone around here. But that's really been it from a sexist perspective. All of the other guys I've ever dealt with in my work life have all been nice or supportive. And if there's been a problem, I'm like, Hey, that wasn't cool or I didn't feel good about that. And this is why most of the time they're really receptive. So I think it is very easy to bag on men or to blame them, but I think in a lot of cases it comes back down to what we were talking about earlier, communication. And if you're doing that and they're still not getting it, maybe they are kind of douchey. But I think overall most guys aren't
Danielle Lewis (23:36):
Totally, and I kind of feel like if that's kind of what you're coming up against, find better men. And I know people will kill me for saying that because it's a mass generalization, but I think we really do have to put our destiny in our own hands. And if we are coming up against roadblocks, we go, that's not for me. I'm not interested in engaging in that. I'm find people who are my cheerleaders and are my supporters.
Sarah Goffin (24:04):
And I think something else that I'm very, very mindful of, which is why I really try and keep in mind, mind mental health and wellbeing is you become a reflection. So if you are attracting bad energy, and I know it sounds a bit wary, but if you are around people and they're not positive people for you, you also have to take a step back and think, well, why are these the people that are coming to me? Is it because I don't feel great about myself? So I feel like I should accept lower standards? What's going on there? So I think again, there's really this element around meeting people at the standard and bringing forward that energy of I got this, I can do this. I'm a positive good person. Because you'll attract those. You'll get haters. We'll get haters, but overall they will disappear under the noise of your cheerleaders.
Danielle Lewis (24:51):
Oh my God, absolutely. And look, I'm all about the woo woo. So love the balance, the work and the woo. That's my I love.
(25:00):
But it's so true. It is very, if you don't actually stop and ask yourself, why am I in this situation? Why am I seeing this? Because if you do kind of take a step back, you will often find that it is a reflection of some of the things you're saying to yourself, the standards you have for yourself. A lot of that, oh my God, I could not agree more. Okay, we could talk all day, but really good. I always love to wrap up these podcasts with one last piece of advice. So reflecting on your career and your time in business, what would be one piece of advice that you would give to another woman on her business journey?
Sarah Goffin (25:41):
I think for me it's be a sponge. Really take in everything. I think for me coming into this and there's so much I didn't know about business, there's so much I didn't know about. Even the markets that I'm working and learning about who are really going to be the people that are going to benefit most from this, who are other markets I didn't even think about. So for example, the people that work in tech but don't necessarily have a scientific background. It's really be a sponge and just be prepared to absorb everything and to take the time to really set yourself up, understand, and to continue to develop what you're doing. It's not just a case of it's done and gone. It's an ever evolving beast.
Danielle Lewis (26:25):
I love it. Sarah, you are absolutely incredible. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Yeah, it was so fun. And I can't wait to reconnect and do it again in a year and see how much you've taken over the world. So thank you so much for your time. I appreciate it.
Sarah Goffin (26:44):
Oh, thank you for yours. It was great.
✨ Thank you to IP Australia for supporting the SPARK podcast and women in business ✨
