#awinewith Lynda Coker
MEET Lynda, Co-founder of Co-Operty.
You can find them here:
Transcript
Danielle Lewis (00:05):
Linda, welcome to Spark tv.
Lynda Coker (00:08):
Thanks, Danielle. Thanks for having me.
Danielle Lewis (00:11):
I'm so excited to have you. Because we have known each other kind of indirectly for bloody years now. We met through scale investors, didn't we?
Lynda Coker (00:21):
Yes, yes, yes. And I want to say that was maybe 2018, maybe 20 18, 20 17, 20 18.
Danielle Lewis (00:31):
Yep. Yeah. Gosh. Time flies, doesn't it? It absolutely
Lynda Coker (00:35):
Flies. Yes. It was 2018, I think. Yep.
Danielle Lewis (00:37):
So good. Well, I can't wait to share your story today because you are delving into a new, very interesting, very exciting, high-tech startup. So I'm so excited to share this new venture. Let's tell everyone who you are and what you do.
Lynda Coker (00:55):
Okay, great. Look, thanks Danielle. So Linda Coca, I am CEO and Co-founder of co-op, which is a new PropTech startup where we actually kind of think of ourselves as a bit of a cross between a PropTech FinTech and RegTech. My co-founder Liz Rohe, another amazing woman and couldn't do it without her. We incorporated the company back in May last year, so 2023, and we launched our MVP in April of this year. And what we're trying to do is given the housing affordability crisis that's going on out there and isn't going to go away anytime soon, is we want to make co-ownership of property residential property easy for people because we feel like it's a real solution that's more cost effective and helps people get on the property ladder faster as well as actually being just a natural circumstance often of owning property. So let's do that better.
(02:03):
And it's not really a digitized area. And in terms of our MVP that we've launched, what we have done is we have platformed the entire experience through to property settlement. So we don't matchmake people and we don't do property search, but we do absolutely everything else. And we're initially sort of targeting first home buyers or younger Australians. We think that's where the most compelling need is for co-ownership. And also parents. So parents who are helping their kids buy a property, but actually we're in beta and we've got some customers which are, for example, we've got two elderly women wanting to buy a house to get that because that's an economically better situation for both of them. And I guess the other thing I should say, which is key to our product is so we platform the experience. So you don't need to worry about doing anything.
(03:05):
Literally, we've plugged in know your client. So whether you are buying the property as an individual or if you are actually buying your part of the property through a corporate or a trust vehicle, often we won't find with parents wanting to help their kids buy a house, they want to use a trust. Maybe we've plugged in prop track where they will authenticate the property and also do a property valuation. Or if people have a property valuation, they can upload their valuation. And we've integrated law lab, which is a national conveyancer who will do the conveyancing. And so literally go through to settling the property. And a key product that we surface is our co-op co-ownership agreement, which is sort of a proforma template to put in place because most people sometimes don't either A think about putting an agreement in place to govern the arrangement, which is actually very important. But even if they do think about it often they don't know where to start to actually put that in place. And it often requires searching for a lawyer to draft it, and that can cost a lot of money. And we've included that in our platform offering. So essentially we will execute the transaction as well as surface this agreement for execution.
Danielle Lewis (04:29):
Oh my god, this is so cool. I remember back many, many moons ago when I was looking to buy my first house and I was looking to do it with my brother. Both of us wanted to get in the property market and just trying look fast forward. I started a business instead and put my life savings into that. But I remember at the time going, I really have no idea where to start. It's almost like the finding the house was the easy part. It was like the everything else. So having it all in one platform and having the ability for people to come together and making that process easy whilst having the agreement. I mean, I'm just thinking about going into business with people. You have to get things written down upfront.
Lynda Coker (05:20):
Absolutely. And we would like to think that we've done a lot of the thinking on around, I mean we around certain issues that might come up during that arrangement. So our agreement is it's not war and peace. We try to make it as simple as possible, but contemplate as much as possible in terms of governing that arrangement. And one thing I should actually say too is that our solution is agnostic as to whether people are buying a property to live in or to invest in. That's your choice. We don't care whether you live in it. But what we are clear on is that we are not an investment product. This is about helping you buy a fraction of a house, but you can live in it if you want, because often people want to live in the house they buy and you actually own it. You're on title with land title. It's not one of those investment products out there, which you own a couple of bricks and you actually don't really own the house and there's no way you could ever live in the house. You do own the house. So we're not targeting and we're not that kind of product. We are genuinely targeting people who, for example, they may be friends or flatmates that live together at the moment. So let's move you from co-parenting to co-owning.
Danielle Lewis (06:46):
No, I love it so much. Where did this idea even come from? How did you get into the idea of co-ownership of property?
Lynda Coker (06:54):
Well, it was a bit of an evolution, actually. I guess a bit of serendipity in terms of both Liz and myself in terms of finding ourself in a place at the same time to do this, which actually, of course the housing crisis has been going on for a little while now. And both of us in different roles in the past had been thinking about doing something like this. I met Liz at Vault Bank, which is the neobank that unfortunately failed. We had a lot of learnings from that, but a lot of great people worked there. And Liz has a mortgage product management background and has spent a lot of time in the sector around funding home loans. And I have always worked in financial services, but my job before this was actually working at one of the big four banks in their innovation lab, looking at different propositions around home ownership.
(08:06):
So I started thinking about different models and looking at actually some of the housing affordability solutions, other solutions that are out there. And when on leaving there, I sort of, Liz and I were both at this point and we're like, okay, look, let's do something together. And we didn't start building straight away. We actually sort of started thinking about, well, where should we even start? And started talking to lots of people and customer research and validating what we wanted to build and what our roadmap would look like. And we sort of started in terms of what I described as our MVP. That's not one and done. We actually have a roadmap of lots of other services we want to layer in where also our revenue model will change significantly as well.
Danielle Lewis (09:02):
I love it. I love it. It's very interesting that you worked in a position of looking for innovation in mortgage property ownership, but it took going to a startup rather than the actual bank that has a whole division for innovation, but you actually launched it through a startup. Very, I find that a bit mind blowing.
Lynda Coker (09:25):
And look, I think, I know a lot of people agree with me on this, and it doesn't need to be a bank. It could be any large company. All large companies have their innovation arms. It's actually really sometimes difficult, even to the extremes, they go to segregate or separate that area from the mothership and BBAU, et cetera. It's, it's still sometimes difficult. And it's not impossible though, but it is sometimes difficult to innovate from within.
Danielle Lewis (09:58):
I mean, I just love it because it just shows that we have the power as business owners, as startup founders to do really exciting things and make a huge impact on different markets.
Lynda Coker (10:12):
So Liz and I are both really, really excited and we've bootstrapped the whole thing. We're now embarking on raising some capital, but I'm really happy in terms of that. We have done that, as painful as that always is for any founder. But I feel like we have definitely created some value. We've got a strategic roadmap ahead. And even actually in terms of the people working with us at the moment in our team, the conversations I've sort of been having with initial conversations I'm having with emphasis at the moment is like, I don't need to go looking for this dream team. They're already advisors to us. I want to employ them tomorrow. So, so feel very, very, very, very grateful. And I think it's a really important problem that we're trying to solve. And look, we're such a big problem that I think you need a number of solutions in the toolkit. I'm not saying that we're for everyone, but I do think it's a real solution for many people.
Danielle Lewis (11:13):
Absolutely. Now talk to me about capital raising. So many people are interested in it, but I think it can be a little bit mysterious for people sometimes. How are you approaching this capital raise?
Lynda Coker (11:29):
Yeah, so I'm approaching it, well, I think everyone should approach it in this way is be looking for investors that can really give you more than money. Do you know what I mean? It's not just about the money. It's actually how can your investors help you in other ways really grow strategically through their connections or their knowledge and expertise? How can they help you find the resource you need as well or anything else? And are they culturally aligned in terms of what you're trying to do? And some investors, some investors just do B2B SaaS or they have their preferences and likes and dislikes for what they invest in. And we are very simple and unregulated at the moment on purpose for our MVP. We don't have a real estate license, nor do I think we will ever need a real estate license to be fair, because we don't do property search and we don't do property management.
(12:43):
If people want to buy a property for investment and they want to rent it out, then we say go appoint a property manager. And we don't act as agent for either party. We don't give financial advice, we don't legal advice, but we encourage you to get it and we can make recommendations for advisors. But yes, so we've kept a very, very, and we're not issuing a financial product at this stage either. So we're very, very simple and unregulated on purpose, but in our roadmap we will become more complex and more regulated. So it's investors that are up for that journey and believe in the opportunity and what we're doing. And look, this is obviously our first capital raise and I am sort of targeting angels, high net worths family offices, et cetera. I'm not necessarily, I contacting venture I guess because I sort of want to ring Francis raise given the stage we're at, but also I'm not entirely sure that this is a venture deal. But yeah, look, every business is different and I think every business has well different not just in terms of its product and market, but also in terms of its needs and business model. So yeah, therefore I think its capital raising approach will be different. Those two should be aligned
Danielle Lewis (14:19):
Because you've been on the other side as well. That's how we met through scale investors. So you have been investing in startups previously and looking at that process, do you think that that's kind of put you in a little bit better stead for doing your own capital raise, having seen so much of it in the past or still just
Lynda Coker (14:39):
As crazy, but it's still kind of always very different when you're in the founder shoes than on the other side of the table? Yeah, look, I'm learning, look, I'm learning so much actually. Do you know what I, but look what I will say. And it's funny, I had this conversation with someone else not so long ago. It's, I've left my corporate job quite some time ago and I've been in the startup ecosystem now probably since 2016 and in a number of different roles and guises, but I've never been the founder. So I've either kind of been an employee in a startup, I've been an advisor, I've been a mentor, or I've been a board member or an investor.
(15:31):
So I feel very grateful and have learned a lot from all those different roles, if you like, in different businesses that I've had the opportunity to work with. And I often sort of feel like most people start in the founder shoes first and then kind of gravitate to all those other things. I've sort of done it a bit back to front, but then I reflect and think well actually do. I'm very grateful. I can't imagine. So long story short, I can't imagine myself having left my corporate job that long ago and have gone straight into being a founder. I think that would've been just a bridge too far. I feel like at least actually stepping into those shoes now, I've had a lot of learning along the way about how things work as well as actually growing my network and connections, which I wouldn't have had if I'd taken that leap. Plus I just wouldn't have been ready. I dunno, things happen when they happen, but actually I sort of feel like whilst I feel like a back to front journey, maybe it's actually kind of the way it should happen, if that makes sense.
Danielle Lewis (16:47):
Oh, absolutely. I mean I think it's so interesting because you've got the perspective. So all of the people that you are now talking to, you can kind of put yourself in their shoes and you've got that perspective on things. I think you're totally right. I mean, as someone who did it the other way went from employee to founder, oh my god, it was so scary. The first time I raised capital, I was like, I didn't even know someone who can lend me a hundred dollars, let alone invest a hundred thousand bucks. So bizarre. And I knew no one and didn't really understand the ecosystem, and it was really a trial by fire and error to get there. So I'm always interested in other people's experiences and how they go about it and what their tips and tricks are because I think it is in saying that I race capital three or four times and I don't think I felt like it got any easier. So I'm always interested in people's perspectives and learnings so that we can share that with other people.
Lynda Coker (17:49):
I don't think it ever is easy to be fair.
Danielle Lewis (17:53):
No, I know. I've come to this realization that just nothing worth doing is easy. You just have to be okay with being a little shit scared all the time.
Lynda Coker (18:02):
Yeah, definitely. And can I just say too, I love that you are actually now taking some of your own learning and actually helping other women in business. So kudos to you.
Danielle Lewis (18:14):
Oh, thank you. I mean, why not, right? I always say to people, if I can tell you all of the mistakes I made so that it can shortcut your success because there'll be other mistakes that you have to go through anyway, so if I can help you a little bit, then why not? I love it. So you said that you are in beta now. So how did you go about acquiring those first customers?
Lynda Coker (18:40):
So we have a very much B two B2C approach. Obviously we are B2C too, but we are not actually expending a lot of effort on that. We have a website where you can launch the app from the website that's direct and we will activate socials and things like that. But we are very, very focused on B two B2C, and I feel like that is a far more, less expensive, easier and faster process to acquire customers. And we are predominantly acquiring customers through mortgage brokers because that's really important upstream conversation that happens. So we're partnering with mortgage brokers because before people actually go and look for a property to buy, they have a conversation in terms of how much can they afford? Yes. That's where we see volume coming. We've actually got a press release coming out very soon, so I won't
Danielle Lewis (19:49):
Spill all the band.
Lynda Coker (19:51):
Yeah, it'll announce a partnership which will really kind of activate that channel where really quite excited. And it's also actually a technology partner too. They have technology which we will integrate, which will really accelerate what we're trying to do too. And we don't see mortgage brokers as the only channel. We see a number of other channels. It's the channel we're focusing on to start with. But we see for example, what I call the council for managing intergenerational Wealth. So we sort of feel financial advisors and estate lawyers are actually the ones that have that conversation because part of the housing affordability issue here is that there's a huge amount of wealth tied up in property
(20:45):
In the baby boomer population. And actually it is interestingly, and I don't want to diverge on a different frontier, but part of what I was looking at when I was working for that bank too, was actually how do we help pensioners unlock home equity? Because a lot of their asset, rich cash poor, that's kind of a different topic entirely, but you've got this huge wealth that is not going to trickle down anytime soon and certainly not down to your 20 and 30 year olds that needed to buy a house. Now. And there are some stats on this, actually, I spoke to someone about it and they said, I think it's people are 52 people are going to be 52 before it actually people need a house and have a family before and want to have a family
(21:44):
Before 50. Yes. You don't have to wait until 52 before it's gone through a couple of generations to inherit that wealth. So yeah, you want to actually have people feel they're empowered and able to buy a property sooner. And there's obviously a lot of macroeconomic kind of factors at work as to why property prices are what they are. And we're not trying to solve that, I guess we're trying to work within the environment. We are at the moment and we see there's a number of solutions out there that try to help people buy a house. You can have a no deposit loan, you can have a deposit gap product or a lender mortgage insurance alternative or rent to buy, or there's some shared home equity funds that are out there or schemes where you actually have a third party owning part of the house while you kind of grow your equity and save to buy. So we're not any of those, and maybe those work for you, but where we feel, what we feel is co-ownership typically has less debt, less fees, and you don't have an unknown third party owning the house. It's actually a related part. So we're actually helping you try and buy now because you're pooling resources and sharing costs, you're sharing mortgage payment repayments.
(23:18):
It's another way of doing this.
Danielle Lewis (23:22):
I love it. I love it. And it makes sense. I'm just thinking about anyone who's looking at a new go-to-market strategy, I think what you've done is really smart going through the brokers, because you're right, the consumers now trying to get into this market that is the first port of call for them. So if you can get in that way and get new customers, I think that's kind of an untapped idea. People think, how do I get to that end consumer? And there are probably people in the middle who already reach that end consumer. So how can you develop a strategy that finds that channel partner? I think that's a really interesting approach.
Lynda Coker (24:02):
Yeah, definitely. And sorry, I did sort of diverge a little bit there. I guess the, no, go for it. I love a good tangent. The other channels that I did want to mention that we want to explore in due course are the property search property agents, buyer agents, even property investor groups. And there are a lot of those do education and maybe co-ownership is actually for people to co-invest, if you like. And I'm also very, I'm having a number of conversations with other startups. I really want to collaborate with other startups and help other startups where they have a kind of product that's complimentary, they're targeting the same market, but maybe they're actually helping you save for a home deposit. So really happy to kind of partner.
(24:55):
And ultimately our roadmap is that we see ourselves as a platform, as a service offering. So all of those parties that I just mentioned, not only are they our go-to-market channels, but I actually see them as potential future customers in terms of actually having this. We don't really care about being the brand. They can be the brand. And this is kind of maybe a feature button. Do you know what I mean? Actually? Oh, guess what? You'd actually like to co-own. Well, hello. You can use this and it's integrated and actually it will execute the transaction and surface
Danielle Lewis (25:29):
Legals. This is so cool. I mean also sounds hyper technical. Would that be an accurate depiction? How are you doing the tech side of the business?
Lynda Coker (25:43):
So we outsourced our build of our MVP. We now have in-house engineering, we source, we'd love to recruit more, which is why we're raising capital. So we still have that firm on retainer. Look, actually, do you know what, I sort of think that the technology that we have built and are planning to build isn't necessarily that, how do I say this? I don't think it's that complicated. The technology's not complicated. What we're trying to do here is more of a business model innovation.
Danielle Lewis (26:21):
Do
Lynda Coker (26:21):
You know what I mean? Yes. It's a platform as a service offering. And we're talking about lots of integrations. But actually, I mean you'll notice one word I haven't used here is AI or I know get out of town. And that's not saying that we can't try to incorporate that, but we are not starting from a, we're trying to do something completely technically complicated here where our starting point is. But absolutely, are we technology enabled? Yes. And are we digitizing an experience that is not yet digitized? Absolutely. But what we've sat back and thought about is actually a business model innovation. And I don't think you have innovation without business model innovation because you know what? Technology is always an enabler. You can have amazing technology, but if there isn't a market or do you know what I mean? It has to be applied to a business model. Yeah. So I feel like we're also talking about on our roadmap, product innovation. So there'll be product innovation and there'll be business model innovation. And yes, it will all be technology enabled and we will be delivering this fire technology. But are we starting from a primary point of the technology is innovative? No.
Danielle Lewis (27:50):
Cool. I love that. And it's such a good point because I think sometimes just being a tech startup is the thing that's romanticized, but at the core what I'm hearing is you're solving a real problem and innovating in a space that potentially hasn't seen innovation in a long time.
Lynda Coker (28:08):
And we are using technology to do that. But it is technology that exists, right? And it just hasn't actually been applied. And it's funny, it's the argument we actually used in terms of not needing a real estate license because actually we're not doing any of those functions anyway that I talked about. But we are providing a technology to facilitate that transaction. So
Danielle Lewis (28:35):
That's so cool. I absolutely love it. Well Linda, you are incredible. Now, I always love to wrap up these podcasts with one last piece of advice. So reflecting on, well, your time in this business, your time in the startup ecosystem, all of the things, what would be one piece of advice that you would give to another woman in business to help her on her journey?
Lynda Coker (29:00):
Oh gosh, there's so many things. Look, I feel like my journey has been serendipity by design. I always kind of label it as that. And if you'd asked me when I left my corporate job, would I be doing what I'm doing now? And would I have gone through that exact process? Like no, I wouldn't been able to tell you that. So I guess what I'm saying is be open. Do you know what I mean? Be open to going down different paths. Not in an efficient way though, but just like do you know what, when I first started meeting people in the startup ecosystem, I just would meet anyone for a coffee or whatever. I was just so this is this world I don't know about. Do you know what I mean? And I met so many great people. I met so many great businesses, I learned so many things.
(30:01):
And it actually, whilst I did later go back and work for a big meeting for a short period, albeit it was an innovation role, I was kind of like, oh no, no, no. This is not where I'm meant to be. So yeah, I think everyone's different, but just kind of say yes, know when to say no and be really open. Surround yourself, not only grow your network, but surround yourself with kind of who you quickly figure out who you can trust. And it's kind of like, I really feel like I have a great support people or group of people that I can go to. I call it my personal board, if you like, that I go to on a number of different things. It's all about having the right network. Believe in yourself, back yourself, look for the right people. Believe in what you're doing. Take feedback. Take feedback. Accept feedback. Feel empowered to give feedback. And I think in terms of women in business, I think women, and I don't want to get onto a gender-based conversation, but I feel like a real strength is that we are great connectors, supporters. And what you are trying to actually build with Spark is kind of interesting. It's exactly that, right? And it's kind of translating a mindset into a reality and live it
Danielle Lewis (31:36):
Again. So incredible. You are just doing some phenomenal things and I've been impressed with you since the day we met. So I'm so excited that you came on the show and shared the journey. It's obviously super exciting and I can't wait to see it unfold and have you back in 12 months to see what's evolved and check in.
Lynda Coker (32:00):
Yeah, well, we've got a busy 12 months ahead, which I know we chatted before we started this call. We just went off. We okay off. I came off on FY 25 planning session, so we've got a lot to do. Yes. But yes, yes. Exciting but scary. But we wouldn't be doing anything else. And so thank you, Danielle. Look, I really, really appreciate those kind words and yeah, thanks for listening.
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